On the way home from the tech day I lost the power steering and the battery and lights light came on. I pulled over in a safe place and there's a healty racket coming from the bottom front of the engine and nothing turning, no fan, alternator etc. Even an idiot like me knows this isn't rite so I call the RAC and after a real long wait he turns up and in 2 seconds tells me I need a tow. OK then, how long? Within the hour I'm told. More like two and a half. So I get her home in true zed fashion. By gargoyle123 at 2011-07-31 And stuff me if the driver doesn't know Adam, enigma, on a first name basis.:rofl: "Sure, I've towed that guy a few times" he tells me. You gotta laugh aye. Now this is the first harmonic balancer that I've heard of let go. Am I missing something or am I just "lucky". So my plan now is to throw the one I have on the built motor on and replace that one with a racing one. I didn't like the ratteling noise at all. I'm hoping it didn't take anything else out. Any stories on these bitches?
I think so, it's at a very funny angle and my fans hitting something down there too. I'm off to find some valium.
This could potentially be VERY bad! I am hoping timing sprocket is still fine and crankshaft undamaged!
awgazam, Aiden, said he'd pop over after work one day and have a look for me. Saved again. It runs normal so I don't think there's a timing problem. The RAC guy said the rubber inside lets go and the pully stops. "collapsed" I think he said. Worse comes to worse I'll throw the built motor in it and build another for the slicktop.
Two possibilities here: The rubber has come away as you mentioned, this lets the outside part of the pulley come adrift and obviously the belts can come off or not get driven correctly. I have seen this happen first hand on a GTIR Pulsar, the entire outer part of the balancer blew apart and threw all the belts off - oddly after a few seconds the belts grabbed what was left and started to drive the alternator etc again. THAT was bloody strange but hey it got us back to the yard The second one is not so good, bolt not tight enough on the end of the crank loads up the key far to much, this eventually chews out and then the pulley starts to spin on the crank. This will normally permanently damage the crank to the point where you shouldn't use it again, if you do the pulley will continuously come loose and could even be out of balance. In the end the crank could break & the 15KG balancer will be let loose at what ever RPM you are doing = not so good for the fella who gets it in the side of his skull From what you are saying about it being on an angle it doesn't sound like you have the better of the two possibilities
Spewin john let's hope its just the ballencer that's dammaged if the crank is bent its game over. Just put a dial gauge on it to see if there is any run off. And if there is don't go wasting your time putting a new ballencer on. Make sure you water pump shaft isn't bent to.
I'm going to put my idiot cap on and make a start on it tomorrow if it's not raining. This looks like a rare case of bad luck to me. I suppose if you don't have the lows, you don't appreciate the highs. I'll charge up the camera and break out the tools, stay tuned.
I think you'll find it's only the outer balancer ring separated from the inner because the rubber bond has failed. I haven't seen it happen on a Zed, but I have seen a fair few on V6 Commodores, which have a very heavy harmonic balancer/damper due to their design (ie 90 degree V6 instead of far better balanced 60 degree V6 in the Zed). If the outer ring is 'cocked' crooked on the inner (which is quite likely), then this could be what the fan is hitting. You might be able to get away with just another balancer and a new set of belts, and a fan - don't trust the plastic fan blades if they've hit something. As others have said, take the balancer off and have a very close look at the crank snout, keyway and the inner surface of the balancer itself to make sure that the crank or keyway hasn't been damaged. If the inner part of the balancer is still tight on the crank and hard to get off, the crank is probably still fine. If the inner part falls off in your hand and there's ANY evidence of it spinning or moving on the crank - look very closely at everything! Also check to make sure that nothing on the engine is leaking coolant or oil onto the balancer. This can soften up the rubber bond over time. Good luck.
you mention the fan isnt sitting strait? you sure its not the water pump? only saying this because you mentioned the fan, and the fan is connected to the water pump. As for the balancer/crank pulley (the zed is internally balanced as far as i know, so its really just a pulley, not a balancer) they can snap off from the end of the crank if not installed properly and start coming loose(should be torque'd to about 160 ft pound on a zed) any other problems are really rare as far as I have heard! Damn unlucky. If it has come loose and damaged the key or anything else, then pretty certain you will need a new crank. but on a good note, nothing else should be affected, because you stopped strait away, everything should be fine, but just check the pulleys on the water pump, alternator also. Has any one removed the crank pulley for any reason? if so, if they have and its come loose, and thats the reason of the damage. I would be going to pay them a visit for causing your pulley to come loose. (also, this is a great excuse for you to get some under drive pulley's) so think of the upside's
When it stops raining I'm going to pull her apart but I'm looking at it and the outer pully is on the piss. All belts are on and the fan is straight. I'd say, with my limited knowledge, that the rubber center has collapsed. Hope so. I'll be back soon with my "expert" opinion. Thanks for all your help guys, it's much appreciated.
"that is shitenhouzen"! No it's not, it's normal for me. The weathers still poo and Jamie, chilledpain, just called and he's heading this way on Thursday with a harmonis balancer. I knew getting his and mine AMS manifolds sent here was a good idea, hold them hostage. I just have to get hold of Aiden to save him the trip now. What a bunch of nice guys. Jamie was wondering if the air con compressor may have siezed and that would cause the failure?
Noooooooooooooo lol... just figured it might have been the final straw... Seen a few people have AC compressors seize up and it just snaps a belt or belt jumps heats up and jumps off etc. Although, it can be fairly violent when it happens. Weird for the balancer to just give up when not under stress... Hence the question to John about any noises prior to it happening. Not saying by any means that a seized accessory of any kind would result in a balancer failing, but if it was on its way out already a seized component maybe would assist in its demise is all...
Zed balancer is fairly typical in design and altho it doesnt happen on a regular basis, its not unusual for them to fail in this way. Particularly if one of the belts are adjusted guitar string tight to quieten down pesky screeching worn out polygroove (Polyvee) belts. Just an inner hub and an outer pulley ring "glued" together with a few mm's of rubber allowing a certain amount of independent movement between the outer ring and the inner hub. Anything rubber and designed to allow movement is going to fail at some point in the abusive environment of an engine bay! S'posed to dampen out vibrations being generated by the crank/belt driven accessories. Dont sweat it! L8r E
